I believe those with conditions that would be considered a problem while flying (vertigo, blackouts, narcolepsy, use of medications that cause side effects that present without warning and could be debilitating, etc.) I was shocked I never thought a medical would ever be an issue for me. However, a few years later when I needed to take a 2nd class physical, I could not pass because of the hearing problem and the AMI made an appointment for me with the FAAs regional medical representative. Please remember, he has a liability also. Anyone who would report this immediately loses their medical and has to wait a year. Discussion in 'Medical Topics' started by Globalpilot, Oct 6, 2018. @Brian B. Try walking in my shoes and you will not agree with that statement. Whether or not your AME issues your medical certificate, the FAAs Aeromedical Certification Division (AMCD) will review your application. By now most of you know there are way too many federal employees standing around over paid and coming up with way too many regulations to try and justify their job. I on the other hand can only fly sport and do when I can find a plane to rent. The FAA processes close to 400,000 flight physicals every year. He passed his 3rd class every time. We report, you decipher. I am not sure whether the doctors are always correct or what specifically they are looking for to justify one pilot is medically fit while another is unfit. How is THAT not a red flag to someone??? Theyre just scared something is going to happen in the air. SOO going by the statistic that YOU pointed outof very few incidents and the comments that have been made that alot of piolts tell little white lies to an AME to keep their medical . My own doctor sent me to the local hospital who cleared me and found nothing wrong. Because the measures necessary to achieve it would make life intolerable dull and stifling. I hadnt had any issues or symptoms for over 10 yrs., doctors Id seen always pronounced me fit & healthy. I dont think its ever been a question about whether pilots lie. Medicine is too concerned with dealing with mental health like a physical disease now you have it and POOF now you dont. We all know that volume of cars on the roads vs. number of planes in the air leads to have to deal with more idiots on the ground. That would shut them down for good. Both asked for, and received, removal of their Special Issuance. I found my regular doctor because I was looking for an AME. Id probably be in better shape if I *wasnt* a pilot since Id feel free to take advantage of those things, whereas now theyre just traps, ways to lose the ability to fly. One of the questions is, have you ever had unconsciousness for any reason.. At worse, you may face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. There are two schools of thought on this issue: 'If you wanna fly, you gotta lie' versus 'honesty is always the best policy.' Special Issuance hoop jumping is expensive. Its not a profession which that college students wake up and decide they want to fly a plane. It's safer to allow people to self-disclose and get help, rather than non-disclosure and possibly flying impaired. I have no problem with the current system. Lie, definitely not. Maybe this will thin out the disastrous ideas, programs, attitudes and regulations coming out of government (like helping poor people buy houses) by ensuring government employees are not under the influence of mind altering drugs or pharmaceuticals and had a good-nights rest unhampered by sleep apnea. Most women get frequent headaches-about once a month, and heaven forbid but we do go to the doctor and get X-rays and tests once or twice a year. Those that are honest will remain so, and those who arent never will be honest. whether, in their life, have they been diagnosed with, had, or presently have a history of ADHD. Ultimately, if you have a condition that you know will result in denial, become a sport pilot. Comparatively, what I take is barely more than a prescription grade Imodium AD. This article does not in any way counsel the reader as to how to appropriately respond to questions on the FAA medical application, nor does it give medical advice regarding the accuracy of the readers medical history. If successful with testing, you can then make further arguments that you do not have an aeromedically significant medical condition. Certification of employees to preform tasks, medical and eye examinations are normal in the Aerospace industry. AOPA and FAA have not really been a lot of help. SO ITS FLY TILL I DIE OR GO TO PRISON. A good AME will grease the skids for you, but dont expect the AME to overlook a problem. Some of the disqualifying conditions are definitely going to keep someone from getting a medical certificate, but these are illnesses such as schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. This exemption is exactly what I need to keep flying, and I am sure there are many others like me. Thus by forcing pilots to avoid medical treatment, in order to protect their medical certificate, the FAA actually promotes ill health and thus diminishes safety. Coronary heart disease that has been treated or, if untreated, that has been symptomatic or clinically significant, Disturbance of consciousness without satisfactory explanation of the cause, A personality disorder that is severe enough to have repeatedly manifested itself by overt acts, Transient loss of control of nervous system function(s) without a satisfactory explanation of the cause. At least three questions on the FAA medical application (Form 8500-8) can identify to the FAA that an individual potentially has a history of ADHD. An applicant who knowingly misrepresents the facts and gets caught can lose his or her pilot license forever and face a fine of up to $250,000, imprisonment for up to five years, or both. Like many organizations, the FAA puts its own authority, power and existence ahead of those, whom it is supposed to serve. People, in general, are in better health than they were 20-30 years ago, largely by not smoking, watching their weight, eating less fatty foods, etc. With the right preparation, you can navigate the process efficiently. FAA sets up high-level alerts for missed airline inspections, Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information. It is also very much a question of freedom. In-case if you ever get into an accident the FAA/NTSB will look through all your medical history and do a thorough check on that pilot meaning they want to look at every doctor visit and all medications you have been on. Needless to say, I have never taken a $100 Hamburger flight. I have been flying for 39 years and professionally since I was 18. dangerous individuals about whom one reads in the news at 10. However you have never been treated or taken medication so probably if you disclose it the FAA would require some sort of doctors evaluation which says you are OK and that will be the end of it. The FAA is charged with both promoting aviation and regulating its safety, which can be conflicting responsibilities. You do not have to be Richard Collins or Ernest Gann simply a GA pilot with a story youd share with friends sitting in the hangar. I HAVE NEVER ACTUALLY TRIED FOR A MEDICAL OR A LISENSE AS FAR AS THAT GOES. Well, I believe we should have to have a medical to operate a car, a motorcycle, a truck, a bus, a train or any type of machine that is exposed to or involved in transportation. But is the whole medical certificate process flawed? thank you, that will be $110. Google "Operation Safe Pilot." In a blatant violation of the privacy act of 1974 as amended, the FAA, DOT Inspector General, and SSA Inspector General, conducted an illegal database match looking for common personally identifying information (names and/or social security numbers) in the FAA medical certificate database and the SSA Title 2 and Title 16 disability databases of 45,000 Northern . A. Thats just BS. I wanted to go to the interview with the certificate already in hand so I could have a slight edge. Many of the requirements for special issuance for example are redundant and simply bureaucratic paper chases. I took medication for years, before I decided I didn't like and chose to stop taking meds (with my parents). there would be no one to fly these jumbo jets. This is very disturbing to say the least, why bother imposing rules, laws or the like if there is no punishment implemented??? Needless to say, I passed. Make no mistake: Form 8500-8 is a legal instrument, unlike many other documents. Have you EVER been dizzy? Too little or false information could park a pilot on the ground'permanently'and lead to fines and jail time if authorities detect a lie or deceit. All three retained their medicals after appropriate medical treatment or new corrective lenses. Until the rules change, abide by them, and make sure you self monitor. Sorry for apparently differing from the crowd on this, but I think people are nuts if they are lying. The problem with the medical certification process is that on the one hand the questions are so stringent i.e. I gave up on my dreams. Dental visits and visits to your AME need not be listed. I read a lot of threads on here about how pilot are getting caught lying on their medical applications. Avoid Medical Certification Delay. I do not expect it to change in my life time. In other words, bigger name on the other line. Again, Im not arguing against the need for medical certification, but the process needs some serious streamlining. Experts offer these tips: When he isn't flying, Paul Engstrom writes and edits from Sebastopol, Calif. Im not dumb enough to eat a big meal then jump right into a plane for the flight back unless it is one with a toilet and someone else is flying! Personally, I feel that if I am medically safe enough to drive then I should be safe enough to fly. Its funny that this question even comes up. The answer is that the population would not tolerate it. I am a nurse and I see it all of the time. Brian, what about a medication that was rx when you were eight and havent taken for 20yrs? I asked him why I had to jump through all these hoops if I could get a waiver. I just left the Marine Corps and want nothing more than to begin my flight training, but I still cant help but wonder about the outcome, especially after all I have read on this thread. Question 17 can identify for the FAA that an individual is currently taking a disqualifying medication such as Adderall, Ritalin, Concerta, Strattera, etc, commonly used to treat ADHD. The Aviation Medical is the most expensive physical exam I have ever had and also the least thorough medical exam I have ever had. Actually, in some years there are 0 attributed to sudden incapacitation, such as heart attack or stroke. I went to my own doctor who advised me it was nothing to worry about. before an incident so we know how to correct. If you dont take a medication NOW, it does not need to be reported. Seems ludicrous to me. you disclose something that warrants further information or investigation, or something happens to you like an accident, incident, or disciplinary action which the FAA will then thoroughly investigate. Everyone at some point or another you all have been diagnosed with something. I completely agree with you. An example is the FAAs recent rule change on anti-depressant use. Yea if you got deep pockets to afford the tests you Probably dont need. Yes, most people that love to fly do what they can to preserve their ability to do so. Some Pilots tend to lie some just do not get medicals. The MedXPress application In order to understand how likely it is the FAA would catch you lying, it is important to understand how they would catch you. Ones health does not distinguish between ones ability to pilot a 2 seater weighing 1320 lbs and a 4 seat airplane weighing 3500 lbs. or special licenses for either of those vehicles if they are used recreationally (with the exception of a written test for air brake endorsement, if so equipped). This in spite of my personal physician and the AMA specifically noting several times that it was a complete non-issue. Should I mention this to my AME? So the Medical certification system is statistically, virtually, perfector..redundant AS LONG AS you are in a multi-crew aircraft. Now Ive been unemployed for a couple months and who knows how long before some beaurucrat decides to actually look at my file snd say ok. Ive followed all the steps they dictated,all my tests and results are right on but because they wont simply look and see that Ive followed thrie rules and was honest,Im looking at becoming a burden to the system and living on public assistance until I get my medical back. I will follow that up with a word of warning. Who gave the FAA the power to stop pilots from flying because they take antidepressants? Im not a Senior AME, Ive only been one for a year. Contact an aviation medical examiner (AME) early if you have doubts or questions. I think that FAA should be concerned about this difficulty in people. And two complete submittals of blood tests. Last summer I went to get my 3rd class med. Thank you for the help. 99.999999% of pilots can and should self-certify for 3rd class flying. It is already hard enough to convince the FAA that you are healthy enough to fly after dealing with lifes curve balls. If the FAA ever decides to search to see if he is taking any prescription medications (which they dont do often, but they have the ability to do), they will most likely pull his medical permanently for falsification. If I remember correctly, being off antidepressant medication for 6 months or longer makes the problem that required the medication no longer an issue. If pilots routinely lie, but its never a safety issue, why do we have medicals in the first place? After 7 years and three more third class medicals-the FAA medical office suddenly decided I had 30 days to provide all the records from a condition I had 20 years ago, or have my medical suspended. Bluskye, the FAA does not have the personnel to handle things quickly.. I cheeted on a eye test flowen with out a incedent. After 30 years without a problem, one would think the risk of incapacitation is no greater than the general pilot population flying on a normal class III medical. My admitting to counselling halted my medical. The other will not. If I have the big one in the seat here is what will happen: 1. I dont know if all pilots lie during medicals, but I do know of one who did. He was a commercial pilot flying 727s. Yes I can agree even thought I am a pilot right now I do want to work for the airlines one day so I will need a first class which I currently hold. Due to the self-reporting nature, the chances of getting caught lying on an FAA medical aren't very high. It is important to point out, according to the AOPA, there have been no accidents related to pilots self-certifying and flying under the Sport program, and many of those pilots Im sure, were under the same misconception as me! Ive been prescribed them, but have stopped taking them simply due to the fact that they are useless and I see no point in continuing to pour money down the drain for nothing. Obviously, the Veterans Administration and the military are still struggling to understand PTSD and have been dropping the ball for 50 years. I have to weigh in on this issue. This is just as important an issue as the proverbial get homeitis.. No, of course you should not lie to your AME, but you should find one who knows how to work with you, and the FAA, to successfully maneuver around those inevitable issues which are bound to come up from time to time during a life of flying. Unfortunate as those events are, they do NOT cause accidents. The system is imperfect in many ways and should be fixed, I do not disagree with that. The FAA medical certification process has at times made me feel that I was in actual hell. Hes very consciencious, and does not tolerate much in the way of obfuscation, at which he appears to be very good at spotting. Im not sure what I think about all this but Ill tell you my story. But the feds harass pilots, not drivers, because they can get away with it with pilots but not with drivers. That is the FAA point of view. How about the person that might have some minor anxiety issues? The other crewmembers will consult the seniority list to see how they fare after my death. In other words, your health is in your hands. I told the truth (that I had a very early-stage, very treatable cancer) and had my medical yanked. Jack, petition the FAA to quit demanding the maintenance of wakefulness test. I am unconscious every night. NONE . The SIC will pull the body out of HIS brand new seat. I really want to fly but Im not sure my passion, not to mention my wallet, will be enough to get me through this process. There are too many who are afraid of liability. Im old, crazy and hard of hearing bit like most experienced pilots I suppose. He never lied. I lost my younger years flying and now the hoopes I have to jump through is unbeleveable.I really love flying but the government can take the privelage away its not right. Bungee jumping. If you qualify for an FAA medical certificate, they will issue it to you at the end of your appointment, document your exam findings, and transmit your application to the FAA. Instead, they send a letter asking for more information from you and your doctors. Everyone should say they have been dizzy. If you are stupid and want to wait months for a medical waiver. Driver licenses are not issued by the Feds. You would be surprised how many complaints FSDOs receive for folks reporting their family members. I know a guy from the US (cant tell his name) that told me that he has lied at least one time, he was overweight and had high blood pressure, he was medicated but he never told that in his annual. It sometimes gets people injured and sometimes gets people killed. Because of that, it is very easy to get away with lying on your medical certificate application. While a diabetic can develop hypoglycemic coma, a cardiac patient faint from an arrhythmia, or a patient become mentally impaired from an excessive dose of a medication, the real world evidence does not support that such incidences are common enough to recommend banning driving by those with such medical conditions. No further action by AWP-300. The 3rd class medical crosses the line where freedom is unreasonably denied in the pursuit of absolute safety. I am an AME and 4,000 hour pilot. The additional costs associated with FAA medicals will reduce flying time for many of us there goes the proficiencey issue again. Aviation medicals protect your lifeand a periodic physical is smart. It doesnt work like that in mental health cases, and probably never will. What does NTSB say? Let me repeat that, every single one, no exceptions. I had to get TWO EKGs to satisfy FAA medical! I had the whole Combined Medical Board (CMB) certifying that I had systolic heart murmur that justified them to ground me from Air Force flying. In example, if you have depression, they dont want to risk the possibility of the pilot (with depression) crashing the aircraft, when in fact flying is the only thing the pilot probably cares about. What I think is if a driver goes to the DMV to go get his eyes checked then that drivers license should be his medical as his third class and it would save the government money because there wouldnt be as many pilots to go after it would just be the professionals. What will actually happen if you are caught lying? They may only get 3rd class, but they are flying with strict guidelines on preflight accu check, inflight accu check, etc. Remember that most pilots who have lost their medicals because they lied are probably not around here to talk about it. Its only a matter of time. Pilot Health - Should I not disclose this on my FAA medical? Some pilots are terrified of the FAA's power to revoke their flying privileges and, accordingly, bend or ignore the rules. In other words, the FAA is not currently able to directly view your medical records without your knowledge or approval. Many pilots get away with submitting false information on their MedXPress applications. If I continue to wish to fly.I had better take care of myself by good nutrition and exercise..on the issue of lying no, I would not lie because not only is it stupid it is cause for losing the ticket. Boating accident deaths 750 Often it is not a case of pilots intentionally lying or withholding information that can get them into trouble, but ignorance of what they need to report. Too much information could mean denial of the application and bureaucratic warfare with the FAA. I had kidney stone surgery 12 years ago and over the last two years I passed two stones at home. Please type or print legibly and remember to sign and date the request. Here is my suggestion: Expand the gross weight of light sport airplanes to something like 1800 pounds. With the impact these regulations and half-baked ideas have on our lives, economy, and national security in general it is time that federal employees comply with all the regulations the citizens that they regulate have to. You can be fined up to $250,000 and jailed for five years for lying to the federal government. I suggest that every pilot take a look at the AME Guide on the FAA website. Of course, as others have posted here NO ONE can truthfully answer no to all the questions because of ever. Furthermore if one has the right against self-incrimination in court testimony, why should one be forced to self-incriminate before a Federal Agency that is extremely bureaucratic, slow to change, and out of touch with reality? Because you were probably the kid who sat at the front of the classroom and said yes teacher whatever you want teacher. We are equally desiring of our freedom, but because we are a small group, the bureaucracy can get away with it. If you submit something on your MedXPresss application that does not agree with previous applications, that can trigger an in-depth review, Your AME can defer your application for any reason that will most like result in further information requests, The FAA could request information based on the results of your driving record search, For military veterans, disagreement between your MedXPress application and your VA disability ratings often earns a letter from the FAA. Now a question: Should 80+ year old pilots with type II diabetes, hypertension, a coronary artery stent or two, on 3-4 medications be allowed to fly a 6000# gross weight airplane with 5 passengers up to 14,000 feet, VFR or IFR without having had a medical exam by an AME? Give blood, nope, they do tests on it, might find something. Thus the FAAs excessive emphasis, on the potential hazards of medical conditions and medications, serves only to reinforce its own bureaucratic authority. That would include most of the trainers (Cessna 120, 140, 150, 152, Piper Tomahawk, etc.) Yet, until recently, the FAA wouldnt allow any pilot to be treated with an SSRI (Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitor) a medication with an excellent safety record concerning accidents. Few people have memory of everything diagnosed as a child, how many appoinments one has been to in the last 3 years, or even knowledge of what the doctor has put in your medical record. Headwind vs. Tailwind Whats the Difference? His first action was to pull out a form with three columns of Have you ever? items each requiring a yes/no response. Faa have not really been a question about whether pilots lie during medicals, they. Why do we have medicals in the air can only fly sport and do when can! 'S power to stop pilots from flying because they can to preserve their ability do... 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